This is basically a survey they are using to develop a marketing strategy on how NAMI can best subvert public condemnation; while still taking the vast majority of their funding from Big Pharma.

I can't wait to see how that flies with disgruntled members and skeptics.

i took this about a month ago.

I have such mixed feelings about NAMI.

In addition to my own bad experience with an antidepressant, I am a close family member of a person with a severe mental illness. (In both contexts, my experience with psychiatry has been overwhelmingly negative.)

NAMI is great in that you can talk to people in a similar situation. I took a class from them and I've been to their support group. Just speaking to normal people and hearing their ideas and what works for them is priceless.

However, their drug stances do concern me. When I took their Family to Family class, they spoke a whole lot about how to convince your family member to take their pills, and I thought they really minimized the severity of possible side effects. I am a moderate on medication -- I think it's overused, but there are some people who do need it, and a big problem is that psychiatrists don't distinguish between these groups at all and just give it to everyone.

One of the things that I was upset about hearing was NAMI claiming that antidepressants grow brain cells and make you smarter. That was the OPPOSITE of my experience on them. I was much, much stupider on Lexapro than I am on my own. If I grew any neurons, they were the inhibitory sort, not ones that help me with higher order reasoning skills.

Another thing they spoke about was the metabolic syndrome. They were open in talking about it, but then the solution they offered is that people with mental illnesses should take the pills, but also go to the gym and eat right. Good luck with that! People without mental illnesses don't do those things, and it seems ridiculous to think that severely impaired people are going to accomplish them.

I also found it problematic that NAMI warned that people with mental illnesses and substance abuse should stay away from 12 step programs. I don't think that statement is backed by research. I actually know people with mental illnesses who have gotten sober in 12 step programs, so they work for some people at least.

Anyway, I think NAMI serves an important function, but they are not perfect. I don't know to what extent their positions are influenced by pharmaceutical donations. Still, they are the only game in town when it comes to support for family members of the mentally ill.

I took the survey and it also struck me as trying to figure out how to spin their image problem.

That said, like the above poster I know several family members of people with severe mental illness who say NAMI helped them alot. (I don't know how much they helped the actual patient, however!).

NAMI isn't the only game in town; there's also a support group called Recovery International, or something like that,which is a self-help organization. It sounds like they have a lot of jargon going on, but it also seems like a cognitive-based, drug-free type of approach.

I have been in many state institutional, private care facilities, and county Mental Health environments over the years. I have never once seen a person representing NAMI in any of those places advocating for a patient and/or giving comfort to a person that was suffering serious distress in their life.

I have to ask those many NAMI family members that thanks this pharma funded organization for their "it's forced medication or death" message; if they are the same people who dump their labeled loved ones in these institutions walking away to rarely, if ever coming to visit them.

If that is the only game in town; no wonder we have such an inhumane, failed advocate, and mental health system.

Personally I believe NAMI is a very bad joke upon all those who truly care about these so called throw away victims, and a unforgivable stain upon the very name of "Advocacy".

Hate NAMI and everything about it. It's not for people w/ mental health issues, it's for their poor put-upon loved ones. Every other question in that survey implied that NAMI does not recommend or endorse specific medications... but hello!! They endorse medication IN GENERAL and nothing else. They even refer to Bipolar and Schizophrenia as "neurobiological disorders"... it never occurs to them that if those disorders were actually neurobiological, they'd be handled by neurologists.

No other modes of healing or research is looked at or presented by NAMI with any seriousness. They could really do a lot of good if they stopped bitching about medication noncompliance and really investigated alternatives to drugging.

@ A 2:33 12 step alcohol and drug recovery programs consider any drug a crutch, which obviously conflicts with NAMI's mantra.

A,

GROW brain cells? They said that?

Since prolonged stress has been linked to smaller brain parts (yeah, brain parts! i said it and i meant it! i'm thinking hippocampus, but i'd have to look it up; 'twas a twin study, war veterans), i could buy antidepressants preventing such long-term damage in depressive patients. Mind you, i've never heard of any study saying that antidepressants do this; i'm just saying i'd find it plausible. (Not that i keep up on psych research. I sure as hell don't.) Maybe this is along the lines of what they meant? Sounds like they did a piss-poor job of explaining regardless.

Anyway, A, i don't know, i think it goes both ways... I'd have to say that depression makes me pretty damn stupid. Not-depression is better for me that way, and meds have helped me out of a depression. (And meds have also not helped me out of other depressions. And i also came out of my Zyprexa fog and subsequent overdose with what seems to be a permanent deficit in my working memory, and obviously we've got no shortage here of getting-burned-by-drugs anecdotes. I have no argument whatsoever with your point but wanted to provide a bit of balance.)

I think i'd be considered "conservative" in this forum regarding my stance on meds. That's awesome! I'm nowhere near conservative in any other aspect of my life! (Except, like, with my 401(k), maybe?) Must think of ways to revel in my newfound conservatism...

"Antidepressants grow brain cells" is a message you will hear from a lot of psychiatrists, if you listen for it.

Here is an example, from a New York Times article about bad parents:

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/10/20/health/20mind.html

"For example, prolonged stress can kill cells in the hippocampus, a brain area critical for memory. The good news is that adults are able to grow new neurons in this area in the course of normal development. Also, antidepressants encourage the development of new cells in the hippocampus."

took the survey.. what a joke

Right when you hear them saying "antidepressants grow brain cells" it's time to run the other way. What kind of brain cells you might want to ask? Ones that are really doing you some good or just wild, crazy neurons that are reacting to some toxic assault? I'll place my bets on the latter. Has anyone ever done any research to find out whether that increased volume is actually leading to feeling and thinking better? I don't think so and I think I know why -- because it doesn't. (P.S. Just me spouting off again.)

There have been a few studies demonstrating antidepressants actually induce the growth of new neurons in the brain. This has been around a few years now and it supports the neurobiological basis of mental illness.

NAMI irritates me greatly-especially on board when one particular person(How does he have the time to do it?) comes on-day or night-whenever someone starts talking about going off meds.

This BS with Astra Zeneca made me DONE with them-they were already grating on my nerves by downplaying alternative therapies and lack of tapering resources.

The survey was weird though.I'm wondering what their criteria will be for tossing certain findings?

In any event I'm sure they didn't like my answers.

"There have been a few studies demonstrating antidepressants actually induce the growth of new neurons in the brain. This has been around a few years now and it supports the neurobiological basis of mental illness."

Not really... speed causes brain cell growth too... but in our ridiculous War on Drugs, the same researchers will call THAT damaging whereas antidepressant brain growth is "neurogenesis".

If you have been determined to be "GOOD" -vs- "NAUGHTY" in the Big Book; Diagnostic Statistical Behavioral Manual "DSBM".

A new elf study commissioned and released by some "Big Jolly Fat Guy" has determined all kinds of wonderful things can happen to those deemed "GOOD" including fabulous gifts showing up under their tree; including new neuron and pathway growth in brain tissue.

Though we have no definitive scientific proof to confirm this theoretical hypothesis at this present juncture; millions upon millions of ardent followers do believe it to be so and absolute unchallengeable truth.

This was factually determined through a series of recent mental health questionnaires and broad behavioral surveys conducted by independent evaluators @ the prestigious University of Elf-isum in Antarctica.

Big Pharma and many associated advocacy front groups have filed court injunction motions and a not so red suit to stop each one of this researchers believers from any future happiness.

They have asked the in Federal District Court covering the North Pole region to rule as a remedy to the infringement upon their own profitable fantasy; that all prior stated believers of the "Big Jolly Fat Guy" be force medicated with their " Pharma's" expensive products until all neuron growth and happy states subside completely.

As a legal basis for this case and remedy; it was stated and presented in documentation before the Court; that the "Big Jolly Fat Guy" blatantly violated their profitable patents, strangle hold on believers, and illegally subverted their marketing efforts related to this important unscientific and marketing matter.

Backing up their contentions was the damning submission of evidence that the "Big Jolly Fat Guy" had not payed off important researchers/officials, or published the proper ghost written research papers to prominent "Fantasy Professional Journey's"; then further evidence submitted stated the "Big Jolly Fat Guy" with calculated forth-thought and cruel intended actions bypassed the usual corrupt authorities at the FDA for government rubber stamp approval.

It has been Estimated that Big Pharma has already spent over 650 million dollars in legal expenses to date on this matter. Pharma Public Relations spokes persons were quoted as saying; "we will spend whatever it takes to protect our ingrained and accepted modality; including our profits and market share from all other forces and intruders in this vitally important fantasy belief area".

On Wall-street, Pharma stock shares increased an average of 1.6% across the board; based on News of a soon to be released verdict.

A final ruling from the court is expected by Dec. 24, 2009.

Took the survey. Made many comments regarding their questionable funding and associations. One area that I was uncomfortable with was the questions covering specifically which newspaper/blog/magazine I had read what I considered negative items about NAMI. I just entered "Sounds like a witch hunt to me" in each field.

I believe that NAMI's current national executive leadership must go, and that its board structure must change - to include more independent board leadership and oversight. Until serious reform happens, I am forced to agree that much of NAMI National's info on medications is tainted by the money it has accepted. NAMI has not been objective or critical enough, and has let mistakes - or industry misrepresentations - linger in its programming and publications. --pk---

I went to the survey site this morning and lo and behold, it is now closed. Guess they've gotten all the responses they need or perhaps didn't like the responses they were receiving?? Darn, another missed opportunity.

"Also, antidepressants encourage the development of new cells in the hippocampus."

Tulipmania, A, and others: I wonder if they are equating "antidepressants" with "the absence of depression". That is, in the absence of depression and its physiological effects (increased cortisol, or whatever), the hippocampus is able to recover.

I do not question the claim that antidepressants can be an effective tool for lifting depression. (Putting aside for a minute questions of long-term safety and efficacy.) A couple of thoughts: Would we see similar changes in people who experience a remission of depression not associated with medications? What about people who take antidepressants but do not experience any change in mood?

(I am curious enough to ask the questions but not curious enough to take more time out of my day to actually go look them up. Thanks to people here who do some of the dirty work for me!)

> "Antidepressants grow brain cells" is a message you will hear from a lot of psychiatrists, if you listen for it.

Ew.

I understand that doctors are used to simplifying their explanations for their patients. Believe me, i am used to people having to dumb things wayyyy the fuck down for me (having acquaintances who were Westinghouse winners and Fulbright scholars and all that shite... I was a bright child who grew into a dumb adult, seriously it just happens that way sometimes) and i super duper appreciate people's patience in explaining things to me... My point with all this babble is that there is an almost palpable difference between explanation and condescension. When i hear explanations that are THAT simple, i get skeptical.